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Fake gems solution

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#1 MrKukurykpl

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 07:31 PM

I think everyone already experienced that feeling when you skip millions of gold and you can't even find a deep spiked gem. That's because everyone does that at the same moment, and the gems are already stolen or under shield. And if increasing your score in game requires luck instead of skill, then the game requires reworking. To solve this problem you can:

1) Encourage players to do higher rituals (Zepto and this idea? Love-o-meter shows no match)

2) Allow to play less ppl at once (Yeah, and then give everyone 10000 orbs)

Or

3) Give players bigger gems

 

So basically fake gems are most common and most stealed ones, There's one problem - they are extremely low in value. Who over 30 lvl should even care about gems smaller than 3k? And what about 60 lvl player? My idea is to increase their maximum value... a lot. You could find gems from 30k up to even 150k. Most common would be the gems ~10k, they can be found, right now, but they are rare and need reworking. Bigger gems also can't be found so easily, so they won't become boring. There should also be lvl limitation, so the biggest fake gems could be only stolen by 45+ players. You won't complain about lack of good gems anymore, GvG and leagues will be much more interesting, and for the most important- this won't be OP. Because fake gems apply to everyone, and everyone can find them, you can't say that this is unfair.

Leave comment :)


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#2 berndt_toast

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 07:49 PM

I'd say this is a good idea. I think that we should at least see deep spikes in the fake bases. I get the reasoning for fake bases, but in order to keep it fun, we need to see higher gems. I'll give this a solid +1 in my book.


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#3 DanFariasM

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 08:56 PM

I slightly disagree on this one... Having played since the release, I remember seing a silver lined or a spiked was like WOAH what the hell is this guy doing...

The cap was 299,999 for a gem, perfects were 899,997 and those silvers and spikeds were considered pretty much the way deeps or baby gold are now, take that with fewer players and it was madness...

When caps were raised, new mines added, all we could see was a general rise in numbers, not in competitivity... Leagues used to end +278,879 and second with +212,975, now they just end millions more... And RonenOsden was top player at 4m, muscat caught up soon with 12m... Now we could make that in 3 days.

If I remember correctly, fakes used to be 3-5k, and of course people complained, they wanted spikeds for god's sake... And they were given to them... Up to 10 or 15k.... Then upped a bit to 30k, and people will keep complaining..

Human nature is to be nonconformist... Even if fakes could get to 99k then it would ve very common to steal a 70k deep, people will complain they only find baby golds and not deep golds... Deltas will rise higher, scores will raise faster...new players might catch up in gem count ...... Differences in deltas, proportionally...... Will stay the same... So what's the point? Just look at a bigger number?

Taking your post as an example (30-150k) you will just add a 0 to every score and that's it, save the difference that the cap will stay the same, so more issues regarding lack of mats to deal gems, people with full inventories, top players getting INSANE deltas by orbing 150ks instead of 30-50k.

That being said, I agree with some kind of reward as in high risk, high reward for bigger rituals, but disagree completely on bumping the fakes.

#4 Plznopotions

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 09:34 PM

I don't understand what you mean by give 10000 orbs. You could base the fake gems off the lvl of the person raiding, though with an obvious cap
Lvl 1-10 fake gems up to 2k
Lvl 11-15 fake gems up to 3.5k
Lvl 16-25 fake gems up to 5k
Lvl 26-35 fake gems up to 6.5k
Lvl 36-45 fake gems up to 9k
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#5 MrKukurykpl

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 09:51 PM

I don't understand what you mean by give 10000 orbs. You could base the fake gems off the lvl of the person raiding, though with an obvious cap
Lvl 1-10 fake gems up to 2k
Lvl 11-15 fake gems up to 3.5k
Lvl 16-25 fake gems up to 5k
Lvl 26-35 fake gems up to 6.5k
Lvl 36-45 fake gems up to 9k


I was just being sarcastic here :) You know, not letting some players play was so bad idea that i had to write sth irrational.
Cool idea, but 36 lvl to 45 could already have fake gems like it's now and 26-35 a little bit higher, so

26-35 fake gems up to 10k
36-45 fake gems up to 15k (I think?)

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#6 Plznopotions

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 10:06 PM

Ok, i thought that fakes were always same max value... Suprised you like it

Edited by Plznopotions, 15 March 2016 - 10:07 PM.

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#7 MrKukurykpl

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 10:16 PM

I slightly disagree on this one... Having played since the release, I remember seing a silver lined or a spiked was like WOAH what the hell is this guy doing...

The cap was 299,999 for a gem, perfects were 899,997 and those silvers and spikeds were considered pretty much the way deeps or baby gold are now, take that with fewer players and it was madness...

When caps were raised, new mines added, all we could see was a general rise in numbers, not in competitivity... Leagues used to end +278,879 and second with +212,975, now they just end millions more... And RonenOsden was top player at 4m, muscat caught up soon with 12m... Now we could make that in 3 days.

If I remember correctly, fakes used to be 3-5k, and of course people complained, they wanted spikeds for god's sake... And they were given to them... Up to 10 or 15k.... Then upped a bit to 30k, and people will keep complaining..

Human nature is to be nonconformist... Even if fakes could get to 99k then it would be very common to steal a 70k deep, people will complain they only find baby golds and not deep golds... Deltas will rise higher, scores will raise faster...new players might catch up in gem count ...... Differences in deltas, proportionally...... Will stay the same... So what's the point? Just look at a bigger number?

Taking your post as an example (30-150k) you will just add a 0 to every score and that's it, save the difference that the cap will stay the same, so more issues regarding lack of mats to deal gems, people with full inventories, top players getting INSANE deltas by orbing 150ks instead of 30-50k.

That being said, I agree with some kind of reward as in high risk, high reward for bigger rituals, but disagree completely on bumping the fakes.

You made some good points, but even you noticed that things changed, now we have semis and perfect gems, and 15k comparing to 999999 isn't much, so what about 2999997?

What's the cool thing in stealing fake 2-6k? Those gems are insanely common! You have to agree that stealing a 50k gem is much more satisfying. Do we really need that small gems, that exist only to make totems look not so empty?

"So what's the point? Just look at a bigger number?" You know, currently this game is ALL about having bigger numbers. Competing-who has a bigger number. Leagues, guild battles, guild rankings, player rankings, in-guild rivalry, your own gem score, castle, traps and gold amount. Even leveling up is in some way a competition.

If having fun in this game requires raising fake gems value, then i'm going to pay the price :D

Also, i didn't want my fake goldens to be super common, just wanted to give chances to have fun to other players, that don't have time/money to play "properly".

Edited by MrKukurykpl, 15 March 2016 - 10:18 PM.

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#8 Plznopotions

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 10:59 PM

No, I don't think fake golds should happen. Nothing is better than the feeling of: mwahahaha I just stole a gold!
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#9 DanFariasM

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 11:00 PM

Yeah but my main point, and what I was discussing with berndt is that stealing a 50k is satisfying just because we rarely see one... What I tried to picture with the era when the game started was that stealing a silver was a good find and stealing a spiked was like.. Forum bragging material... Now it's not even like.. Meh.. Another spiked... Because we find them. If fakes are deeps, they would become so common that the feeling of finding them as rare would be gone.

Regarding the big numbers, yeah, but tops will grow exponentially too... Soon you'll realize that yay, you finally got to 100m, while Michael / evil or whoever is just hitting 3 billion, so in the search of looking for a "fix" to have a bigger number, we will get our hopes crushed by the same guys and the situation would be even worse... Given by how the challenges of "steal the most amount of gems" end, they will still be the ones to get the most fakes, to whatever the amout they raise them and the whole story will repeat exactly like when we had 3k fakes, 4m top 1 player and 100k top deltas.

Not sure if you will feel good watching your score grow... Compared to yourself before the fix.. But still will be proportional to a similar share of what tops would make.

I mean, should we feel good because we can steal in a day what the top beta player had after about a year? Compared to that is an awful lot of gems :P it's the closest example of inflation in real life but represented in a game, and if you know how inflation works, raising salaries and printing bills is not the way to fix it haha.

#10 AnonymousGamer

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 12:12 AM

Thats just a such a cool idea. Hopefully, Zeptolab brings it.... Hopefully?!


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#11 Plznopotions

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 01:15 AM

I agree with dan. The highest possible fake gem is 12000? I mean that is a decent steal even for high levels

Edited by Plznopotions, 16 March 2016 - 01:16 AM.

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#12 GrriZzly

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 03:40 AM

Id like new fake gems aswell but then deep spikes would be more common and scores as Dan said would rise faster. I sell all spiked gems for demotions and only steal deeps or golds. The big players have $ though they are grown men, with good jobs, almost gambling it away in KoT ._. Aahh money

Edited by GrriZzly, 16 March 2016 - 03:45 AM.

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#13 Debug

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 04:06 AM

Exactly 30k could be the limit of fake gems?
Well... Dan is right. If everyone raise their score like they would only raiding for 2k-5k gems, the only diference would be the number. If i have 29k delta (which i really have :P) and steal a 30k gem, i would be like yay beat that league (im in orbeseus now) but if everyone start to raid those 30k too? No difference. One thing that could change the game is if we could merge perfect gems on a super perfect gem (11.999.998 which actually should be 11.999.988 but whatever).

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#14 Sorry Dude

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 04:56 AM

This will bring inflation. Less rituals to make perfect gems. Less Ingredients to store them. More orbs spent storing them. Less orbs for me to steal a gem. End of the orbs to buy ingredients. No more space. No more gaming. Inflation is no good. -1


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#15 GrriZzly

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 04:59 AM

Inflation yes thats the word i was thinking of :P

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#16 Bryce

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 06:20 AM

Yeah but my main point, and what I was discussing with berndt is that stealing a 50k is satisfying just because we rarely see one... What I tried to picture with the era when the game started was that stealing a silver was a good find and stealing a spiked was like.. Forum bragging material... Now it's not even like.. Meh.. Another spiked... Because we find them. If fakes are deeps, they would become so common that the feeling of finding them as rare would be gone.

Regarding the big numbers, yeah, but tops will grow exponentially too... Soon you'll realize that yay, you finally got to 100m, while Michael / evil or whoever is just hitting 3 billion, so in the search of looking for a "fix" to have a bigger number, we will get our hopes crushed by the same guys and the situation would be even worse... Given by how the challenges of "steal the most amount of gems" end, they will still be the ones to get the most fakes, to whatever the amout they raise them and the whole story will repeat exactly like when we had 3k fakes, 4m top 1 player and 100k top deltas.

Not sure if you will feel good watching your score grow... Compared to yourself before the fix.. But still will be proportional to a similar share of what tops would make.

I mean, should we feel good because we can steal in a day what the top beta player had after about a year? Compared to that is an awful lot of gems :P it's the closest example of inflation in real life but represented in a game, and if you know how inflation works, raising salaries and printing bills is not the way to fix it haha.

You hit me right in the nostalgia...







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